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thepolarfoxqx

no more chrysler?

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thepolarfoxqx
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In the last physcal year, Daimler Chrysler's sheets showed the european divison (that would be mercedes benz) made a profit of just over 1.1 billion dollars, and the north american division (that would be chrysler) lost all but 126 million dollars of it.

There has been word around the Daimler Chrysler would either remove north american brand names, or the entire north american division all together due to losses. Initial reports out of stuttgart deny this, but word continues circulating that if next year is as bad or worse, the ax may come down.

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LateNightCable
Geschrieben

Somehow I don't see them completely axing Chrysler, aside from the business end of it, think of how many people they would put out of work. Somebody would have Daimler's ass on a plate.

Daimler probably keeps Chrysler on a pretty short leash financially. If things got too out of hand I think they would be more likely to cut ties with Chrysler rather than end it all. Either way, it would be a mess to clean up.

thepolarfoxqx
Geschrieben

cut ties with chrysler? they are technically speaking a division. If they spun them off (which would approach impossible), they would take a hit in the market like you couldn't believe. It would not be prudent. Reports are that the Dax/Xetra would rally on news of chrysler being axed, sending cyclical heavy industrial stocks higher (as it would spell drastically higher profits for daimler). I know they'd kill tons of jobs. Just the same, killing jobs didn't stop GM and Ford from moving plants to mexico in the 80s, i'm not sure who could get daimler's ass on a plate.

If nothing else, they are planning heavy restructering for north american brands, which spells definate heavy layoffs. They lost nearly a billion dollars last year, in the same year, daimler made over a billion selling 1/10 the number of cars.

LateNightCable
Geschrieben

The main reason Daimler involved itself with Chrysler is for increased market power, like any merger, and also because they thought they could turn Chrysler into a nice little cash cow. I imagine congress could have Daimler's ass in some form or another, we're talking about a hell of alot of people landing on unemployment very quickly if Daimler did anything rash. The government tends to get itself involved in such matters when the scale is large enough.

If Daimler cut ties, they could cut their losses, move on, and be where they were before. They made a merger, and they could end one.

If they ended a division, it would probably be Plymouth. Wasn't that going to happen anyway?

By the way, HAPPY ANNIVERSARY POLAR! 2000 posts :D:P

thepolarfoxqx
Geschrieben

congress could try, but they are a german company. I doubt they would do too much. They'd have hearings into it, but it isn't in any way illegal.

they will lay people off this year, and if next year is like this one, it will get worse.

GIR
Geschrieben

I can see this happening already. It was supposed to be a merger of 2 equals and for both companies to get a foothold in each others markets. While MB has had great success in the US, Chryslers progress in Europe isn't that great. MB can really do without Chrysler, they have a strong presence in the US market which was one of the main points and the only thing Chrysler does is guzzle up their hard earned cash.

It's kinda like getting married. While you go out and work hard to earn money your wife does her best to spend it all leaving you with just enough money to have a little fun. I think it's time for a divorce.

/edit: Also firing people in the US isn't that hard compared to the EU, which is one of the many advantages the US still has over the EU (for corporations that is). I don't think congress can do much expect hold an inquiry and maybe subzidize the automotive industry like they've done so many times for the airline companies. Remember that Ford and GM have also said they're going through ruff times.

The unions could do something about it but last I remember the US isn't that big on unions. Over here the unions would eat Daimler Chrysler alive if they ever tried to pull a stunt like that.

thepolarfoxqx
Geschrieben

the unions would suit, they would win damges, but it would be cheaper than keeping Chrysler running.

BTW, thanks LateNite, it hardly seems like yesterday i put up my first post on M5, on thursday it'l be a year. Wow.

imported_Aston Martin
Geschrieben

Please god, tell me it's true! I don't know, but I guess it might be because ''Mercedes Benz'' has a much better ring than ''Chrysler''. Also it might be because Crysler make dumpy cars that no European is dumb enough to purchase. Case in point would be the neon...

thepolarfoxqx
Geschrieben

you are the man.

The neon is awful. I was argueing about how awful they were in another thread. The neon sucks SOOOO bad.

Chrysler cars are awful. It doesn't suprise me they are hemroging money like wild. They have to better than give their cars away to keep them going.

It's sad. Wait till they have to come good on that 70,000 mile warrantee they're offering. That'l hurt.

LateNightCable
Geschrieben

They'll make the 70,000 warranty, they wouldn't dig themselves a hole that deep if they couldn't get out of it.

thepolarfoxqx
Geschrieben

they might. It'l cost them i'm sure. They did it because they needed to sell cars of face major restructuring and very large layoffs.

GIR
Geschrieben

Just the name Neon sais enough I guess :)

Anywayz the Neon isn't a big success but the Sebring and specialy the Voyager have had some what market penetration.

While reliability is still a mayor factor these 2 cars give you alot of value for your money. The European market has always been big on MPV's. The Voyager gives you alot more then other manufacturers have to offer.

I think the problem is in the fact Chrysler doesn't advertise their products well if at all over here. Ofcourse most European people buy European cars just like most American people buy American cars. MB and BMW already had a name in the US so market penetration wasn't that hard todo, but Chrylser doesn't have a name over here, they really need to kick their advertising campaign into high gear.

LateNightCable
Geschrieben
I don't know, but I guess it might be because ''Mercedes Benz'' has a much better ring than ''Chrysler''. Also it might be because Crysler make dumpy cars that no European is dumb enough to purchase.

Who asked you Martin? If Chrysler was the over priced German maker, and Mercedes made the domestic American stuff, you would say Chryser had a better ring. Say it ... " Chrysler ", say it long enough and it starts to sound like quality. I seem to recall a loyal following of Chrysler Vipers' on your home turf. :D

The Voyager has had some market penetration? Over here the thing is an industry.

thepolarfoxqx
Geschrieben

chrysler used to be pioneering. Their quality was never great. They stopped innovating and being new, so now the competition owns their ass.

imported_Aston Martin
Geschrieben

I hate to tell you this, but as far as U.S cars are concerned, they'll never get any foothold in the European market. They don't go around corners. That's okay for the U.S, but not here. Also the engines are known for being big, but hardly refined - they devour oil fields whole. The suspension is too soft or too hard. Chrysler nose-dived here, as did Cadillac (Sp.?), and Chevrolet. The only U.S motor company to operate actively and do well here is Ford, and that's because they make separate models for Europe which are nothing like the U.S models. I still think Mercedes-Benz sounds better. Even with nationalities reversed, Mercedes would still have the better image and sound.

Who asked me? It's a general question. I wasn't aware it was only for people with the 'right' answers.

thepolarfoxqx
Geschrieben

some american cars go around corners. I will agree they are on the average sprung and tuned way too loosely. quality of chrysler and GM, and to some degree north american ford just isn't to par with european standards. Euroford does share parts with north american ford. Transmissions, engines, platforms etc. It shows it can be done.

LateNightCable
Geschrieben

I'm not talking about image, but as for sound, how about " Daimler "? What a ring.

Europeans aren't "dumb" enough to by American cars, but apparently they're not too smart to buy Fords :D . Essentially, it's all about the right market presence, Ford has it, Chrysler and GM not so much. So all they really need to do, is sell different cars than the ones they sell in the states.

Nobody asked to hear your prejuduce against Chrysler cars, and indirectly American cars as a whole. Your views of them being " big, hardly refined, devouring oil fields " and Europeans having to be stupid to buy them, shows your glaring ignorance.

thepolarfoxqx
Geschrieben

american cars sell unbelievably poorly in europe.

Mostly because they were built with fuel economy, compactness, and refinement as low priorities.

GIR
Geschrieben

Once again I'll repeat. The Voyager van is a great MPV compared to others. For that money you get more car then any other manufacturer, it's just the reliability that's gotta be worked on. Like Cable said it's all about presence. They just gotta make a stand in the European market and I'm sure the Voyager would sell, if people knew about it.

LateNightCable
Geschrieben

That reminds me, Chevrolet has such a good reputation, and therefore presence in Mexico, that when they introduced the Venture minivan there you know what they called it? Not Venture, just " Chevy ". Theres' dynamic marketing for you. :P

thepolarfoxqx
Geschrieben

sure. then again chevy did introduce the nova to mexico as the nova.

nova translates to no go.

not a sales winner.

if they would spend the money on voyager like they have on other models, get newer more developed engines in it out of the parts bin, fine tune quality, and perhaps call it a daimler chryser voyager, it would sell (people would also call in bomb threats on mercedes for daimler being on it though)

imported_Aston Martin
Geschrieben

No one asked to hear your national pride over sense, either. It's an opinion, so get over it. As for it being ignorant, there must be a great many ignorant people around the world, then. If you choose to label Europeans as ignorant for NOT buying them, in the face of better cars from Europe and Japan (yes, that's an opinion too), then I guess that makes a great number of us ignorant.

I thought the U.S was a big promoter of the freedom of speech...? If that is so, then I think you've got the wrong idea about it. Freedom of speech also involves opinions which you may not think true, but should be given the chance to be voiced anyway.

LateNightCable
Geschrieben

My feeling toward American cars is not entirely about pride, it's about giving credit where credit is due - equality, which goes along with freedom of speech around here.

Europeans can buy whatever they want, it's fine with me, and I never once labeled them as ignorant, just you. Although you did imply that Europeans would have to be dumb to buy American cars. You have the perfect right to state your opinion, but when you start spewing offensive statements about the way an entire nation builds their cars, I'm going to call your ass out on it.

And before you go digging any dirt on me, I will admit that I recently questioned why Italian sportscars were " impossible " to work on, which was not intended as an offense toward Italians, but rather an inquiry as to why their exotics were indeed, difficult to work on. I love all cars when it comes down to it, and I would never trash a whole nation's auto industry like you have. You have the freedom of speech thing down pat, now lets' try thinking democratically Martin.

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