japan vs. europe ( skyline r34 - m3)

[izzyloveslizzy]

Yeah, Hands Down.

Japanese engineering reminds me of cyborgs, for some reason. It's all a lot of roboticizes mass-produced cheap reliability. Not that that's neccessarily a bad thing, but I'll take teutonic hardware everytime.

And yes, Fox, that IS a hel of a bargain. One of the many reasons BMW (and other German auto-manufacturers) deserve to succeed.

[bleh]

Originally Posted by thepolarfoxqx yeah, well, let's look at it this way, the dinan S2-M5, which is naturally aspirated, can turn a 0-60 in 4.1 (that beats both an F360 and a F575M), slaloms to beat an F575M, and costs $100,000, it also seats 5. I'd say that was a hell of a bargain.

damn!! i must own one. does dinan have a website or anything? i found my newest obsession for that distant day of retirement.

Originally Posted by izzyloveslizzy Japanese engineering reminds me of cyborgs, for some reason. It's all a lot of roboticizes mass-produced cheap reliability.

thats a lot of why i like them. makes working on them so much cheaper and easier. but thats all relative.

[izzyloveslizzy]

Originally Posted by bleh ...but thats all relative.

[thepolarfoxqx]

go to dinan's website or read the C and D review of it. Dinan S2-M5 is a beast. It is wild. New flywheel, exhaust, suspension, whole new intake system and cams, as well as software and a shorter rear end, 4.1 for the heavy E39 M5 to sixty.

If I could, i'd have one tommorow.


And it's true. Japanese cars were never designed to be worked on. They are a *****.

European cars designers actually planned for someone trying to fix there car at some point.

[izzyloveslizzy]

Abso-friggin'-lutely. I couldn't agree more. Try NOS'ing-up a Japanese car (an Acura) for example. I'll bet you 4-1 the odds are aganist your engine making it out of the shop alive. Try it on a German car, however, and the results will be different. Europeans (especially Germans, Brits and Italians) build their cars tougher than Asians, which means your cylinders aren't likely to explode if the compression and pressure becomes immense. And the funny thing is, Asian companies use "aftermarket capability" as one of the main "specialties" of their cars.

[LateNightCable]

Bleh, wasn't it you who was defending a souped up Eclipse in another topic? I would not trust that Mitsu for long term durability. It's okay for a cheap blast, but cars like that are use and throw away.

A European machine is something you can invest in long term, and build a history with. It won't degrade into a creaky bucket of high performance parts with no ride quality.

[thepolarfoxqx]

if you're into violent tuning, a mitusbishi is a great car to do it on. With a beefed up bottom end, mitsus are pretty cheap, put out and down the power pretty well. Furthermore, mitsu engines are amongst the toughest japense ones around. Just the same, any car with violent tuning won't have any sort of durability.

european cars usually don't require violent tuning to bring the power, and if you do violent tune them, they are built more solidly. That is why they're more expensive, but it's worth it. Thicker, higher quality cylender liners, better pistons and and bottom end componenets. They're just better motors. I think the cost is well justified, but lots of rice disagree with me, i've been told lots of times "yo homes, you just strap the NOS and go, dip on yo shit every time, who cares about durability. shit works. it breaks, i'll buy a new one"


I wish i could be as rich as 22 year old civic driving punks, cause i can't afford a new car every other month.

[izzyloveslizzy]

Hmm. I'd rather drive a super-tuned Mitsubishi eclipse than a violently tuned Civic. For long-term reliability, neither is going to perform well, but the Mitsu would get the better end of that. And it would look better too. Although, I don't know about the whole idea of a big NOS system beside you in a Civic or Eclipse or any other car of that level. That just doesn't lok right. It's almost like polishing a turd (especially in the case of cheaper Japanese cars). I should note, though, that Mitsu still makes a kickass car, and probably the best (or one of the best) to come out of Japan.

[bleh]

Originally Posted by LateNightCable Bleh, wasn't it you who was defending a souped up Eclipse in another topic?

yes, whats your point? you can make them fast and it can be reliable if you take the extra precautions. as far as this thread goes, yes european tuning is better than japanese and in the case of the m3 vs the skyline: as stated before the skyline only wins straight line. i dont understand your mentioning me.

as far as mitsubishi's reliability: i never trusted dsm's and i never will. i know for a fact that obviously nissans(the skyline takes a lot of heat), and toyotas supra engines are built more solidly than mitsus engines. sorry that point was off topic.

what is this talk of violent tuning? if its tuned correctly then it will last longer, if its not then it wont. you you were to put a 125shot of dry nitrous in a civic engine, then you screwed up and you just destroyed your car due to bad tuning. but if you were to reinforce( or replace) the engine internals (which is very cost effective in a civic) you can very easily run a 125shot wet nitrous system. now are both violently tuned? but will yeild the same results, but one will most definitely out last the other. dont think im trying to bash your vocabulary, im just trying clarify. european engines just come with a finer tune to begin with.

izzy: a super tuned mitsubishi vs a violently tuned civic....hmm, long term reliability, neither perform well? i dont want to get repetitive. honda vs mitsu? and you chose mitsu? they made the 3000gt, not one of the best. their cars do look nicer, ill give you that, but if they are all turds who cares anyway? i cant agree with you about the rest. i really cant see mitsubishi being better than nisan or honda.

[thepolarfoxqx]

the thing is, the average rice cruising about isn't fine tuned well.