New Corvette

[thepolarfoxqx]

chevrolet lists the 0-60 time for the C5 corvette as 4.9 secconds, BMW lists the 0-60 time of the E46 M3 as 4.8. That is faster.

Base list price on a 2004 M3 is $45,900, a comperably equipped C5 coupe comes in $47,340, this is not to mention that the interior of the vette is an embarassment (though i'm happy to say that the C6 does have a very much improved level of interior quality).

What I meant by pushrod era gone is that no european or asian companies still use them, ford and daimler chrysler look to stop production of their pushrod engines by 2007 (ford only still makes the 3.0 vulcan (currently being phased out to coenside with taurus being replaced by the new 2005 ford 500), and the 3.8/4.2l v6, currently only going into minivans (which is slated to be replaced with the 4.0L unit, no date has been set though). Chrysler is replacing it's 3.8L OHV V6 in its minivans with the 3.5L SOHC unit for 2005 (it was going to be done for 2003, but money troubles stopped it), and their 2.7L unit is going to replace the 3.3L OHV V6 for 2005 or 2006 (i've yet to find a definate date).

That leaves GM alone. GIR can tell you, as anyone with an engineering background could, the pushrod layout is inherently less efficient, and has less potential for specific output. that is engineering fact.

the leaf spring issue i have is this, the spring properties of a leaf spring verse a coil spring make it clear that for a car, a coil spring offers better dynamics in terms of response to handling, and can respond faster, that's just physics.

I'm saying the corvette could be an amazing car, top of its class on the world level, if they'd only give it a modern engine and suspension. It is my favorite american sports car, i like it a lot, i just feel its an injustice to keep on the same basic technology it was using 20 years ago when it could be something so great.

[LateNightCable]

There we go comparing American machinery to European again though. To the Corvette's credit, if a 4.9 factory claim is not fast enough for you, it's engine can easily be modified to produce enormous power, where as what can be done with the M3 is quite limited in comparison. And I don't think an M3 ever leaves the dealer costing anthing less than 50-51k when all is said and done. You can get a highly capable and entertaining base Corvette coupe with a Z-51 suspension package for less.

The leaf spring concept and pushrod motor may have " issues ", but none that effect the Corvette to any great degree, the whole thing works just fine. When driving a Vette, I'm not thinking about issues, but rather on exploiting the car's strong points of which there are many.

And about pushrod engines going away, Viper V10 isn't going away, 6.0 Power Stroke diesel sure isn't going anywhere, same goes for the GM Duramax and 5.9 Cummins. From where I stand, pushrod technology has never been more efficient, or as strong.

[jterp]

Fox, why do you automatically equate "small and efficient" to "great" ??

Why do you automatically assume that because the European car makers are doing something 'different' that they are doing it 'better'?

The C5 corvette is faster than the E46 M3. After the sprint to 60 the corvette beats the M to the quarter mile by 4 tenths. It is faster in the quarter mile, performs better on the skidpad, and has been quicker around every ractrack that I have seen the two on together. It is a faster car, case closed.

Edmunds.lists the price for an '04 corvette as $44,535 - $52,385 (were you just making your numbers up?)

price for an '04 M3 is $48,195 - $56,595 = Corvette is faster and cheaper than an M3. (And I have NEVER seen a BASE M3 on any lot -- lowest MSRP I have seen on a lot is $53,xxx)

As I said before, how small and efficient the engine is doesn't mean a damn if you aren't the first one to the finish line.

And for the last time (again!) no one cares about the interior!!!!



** btw I am not knocking the M3 -- It's an awesome car... but if i have $5x,xxx to throw around its going toward a vette..

[thepolarfoxqx]

nope, actually i got it from the comparison part of BMW's website. I saw a pretty nice black M3 coupe just the other day for 48k at the dealer lot.

And people do care about interior. The interior in C5 is awful, to quote motor trend and car and driver it is "right out of a cavalier" and "rental-car grade", i'm not alone in thinking the interior is hella-sucky. I think the corvette is a great car, i think i've said that every post, are you just trying not to see it?

I think that seeing as the only vehicles still to use leaf springs are pickup trucks, the vette would be EVEN BETTER with coil springs, and aside from the viper motor, and dodge's hemi (which is technically pushrod, but has a head layout similar to what a 2V DOHC would look like), pushrods are on the way out, and diesels are a whole different ball game, and in semi trucks, the newest ones are all SOHC. Don't compare diesel engines to gas, it truly is apples to oranges.

[LateNightCable]

All the same, pushrods are not going extinct. Yes, aside from the Viper motor, which is still going strong, as well as GM's Series III V6s'.

A standerdized engine like an LT-5 would be cool, but with that, and a coil spring rear suspension, the price could easily creep up. Corvette is supposed to be America's affordable sports car, so until those more modern features can be made just as cheaply, old tech will do just fine.

[thepolarfoxqx]

but i think GM has everything in house to do it for the same price they are doing it for now, and if it cost them 2 or 3 grand more, i'd find it worth it.

[jterp]

I see your point and do understand that you like the corvette -- my only point is that liek the old saying "if it aint borke dont fix it ... " -- In its price range the corvette is the best performing car -- it obviously aint broke if nothing can beat it.. so why change it? Believe it or not, the folks who are buying the corvettes LIKE the pushrod engine. They LIKE the leaf spring suspension ... why change it just because the Europeans do?

[LateNightCable]

Yeah, personally I like the idea of riding on a mono leaf spring, it's kinda cool, like a Citroen that rides on hydraulics. We understand that you like the Corvette and all, but you seem to have a real beef with the leaf and pushrod, why? It would be one thing if the performance of these items were lousy, but they aren't.

I think GM is willing to make a few exceptions for the Corvette, because it's charictor and heritage is so strong. The same way Porsche has stuck with that funny little rear engined car of theirs all these years. If keeping the hard edged American flavor of the Vette means forgoing slick modern technology that every European car is using, then I don't mind one bit. In fact that just makes a Corvette victory more sweet. European cars are clean and modern, and the Corvette is a strong stubborn old mule that won't change it's ways. I like that.

[SERGIOE34]

My road and track road test summary has the m3 at 13.3@106.8 and the vette at 13.4@107.5 so i thout the m3 was faster.

[jterp]

dont believe everything you read